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#1 2013-04-11 08:34:03

Steel
Member
Registered: 2008-02-16
Posts: 2521

LCBO Strike

Soo...the LCBO union workers think they need more job security and better wages and are willing to go on strike to get such.

Memo to your idiotic union.....the fastest way to lose your job given the general public's sentiments regarding booze distribution in this province is to distrubt the monopoly that are a strangle hold on its distribution. Do that and in a matter of days the public will turn on you and you'll see just how secure your jobs really are and what a clerk on a cash register should really make.

Fastest way to private sector distribution, like 9 of the other provinces, is for the LCBO union workers to strike. have at it boys and girls...you'll make the majority of Ontarians very happy and you'll find yourselves out of a job.

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#2 2013-04-11 13:17:55

Blueline
Member
Registered: 2008-06-25
Posts: 191

Re: LCBO Strike

Steel...you've expressed many times here about favoring private distribution and eliminating LCBOs but you still haven't come up with a suggestion on how to replace the profits generated.  Replacing these profits would mean either higher taxes or reduced services.  Which do you prefer since it is one or the other.

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#3 2013-04-11 14:12:02

Steel
Member
Registered: 2008-02-16
Posts: 2521

Re: LCBO Strike

Blueline wrote:

Steel...you've expressed many times here about favoring private distribution and eliminating LCBOs but you still haven't come up with a suggestion on how to replace the profits generated.  Replacing these profits would mean either higher taxes or reduced services.  Which do you prefer since it is one or the other.

The Province of Alberta privatized its distribution system and the following year the net tax revenue from booze sales was $260 million MORE than the previous year.

The taxes generated on the sale of booze does not change whether it is the LCBO selling it or private industry. The LCBO generated a little better than $2 billion in tax revenue for the Province last year. Every province that has privatized distribution has seen a massive increase in tax revenues when they privatized the system.

Thats what happens when the distribution system is privatized.

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#4 2013-04-11 14:15:37

Steel
Member
Registered: 2008-02-16
Posts: 2521

Re: LCBO Strike

Further it is a myth that the LCBO makes a profit. The "profit" they say they make is the TAX revenue they generate. The mark up on product itself allows the LCBO to break even.....due of course to its bloated and massive overhead. The LCBO never makes a profit....they are simply a very expensive way to collect taxes on booze

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#5 2013-04-11 15:26:34

Blueline
Member
Registered: 2008-06-25
Posts: 191

Re: LCBO Strike

Steel wrote:

Further it is a myth that the LCBO makes a profit. The "profit" they say they make is the TAX revenue they generate. The mark up on product itself allows the LCBO to break even.....due of course to its bloated and massive overhead. The LCBO never makes a profit....they are simply a very expensive way to collect taxes on booze

Not true...see my earlier post on this topic which totally discounts your hypothesis.  Nothing has changed since our last discussion.  Yes it is probably "bloated" but even still it generates profit not just tax revenue.

Last edited by Blueline (2013-04-11 15:27:48)

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#6 2013-04-11 16:20:20

Stratfordian
Member
Registered: 2011-11-11
Posts: 127

Re: LCBO Strike

Blueline wrote:

Steel wrote:

Further it is a myth that the LCBO makes a profit. The "profit" they say they make is the TAX revenue they generate. The mark up on product itself allows the LCBO to break even.....due of course to its bloated and massive overhead. The LCBO never makes a profit....they are simply a very expensive way to collect taxes on booze

Not true...see my earlier post on this topic which totally discounts your hypothesis.  Nothing has changed since our last discussion.  Yes it is probably "bloated" but even still it generates profit not just tax revenue.

A government agency (it is not a store) that has statutory power to set prices, and has a policy to set prices at an arbitrary minimum price for the sole purpose of regulating consumption, that compels all private resellers (restaurants, pubs, etc.) to purchase from it and it alone, that controls by law the importation of all alcohol does not generate "profits".  A private corporation that purchases its goods on the open market and then, based on its overhead, sells to the public at prices determined by it is capable of making a profit (or loss).

The LCBO as a government agency looks like a business but it is not.  It is an arm of the government, therefore the funds it generates beyond the government expenditures (not private, government) needed to pay its government employees, rent, and so on, represent a tax.  You cannot even call it a voluntary tax, again, it is a monopoly.  Unless "freedom" means choosing not to drink liquor, or drink any liquor or wine at a restaurant (beer is sold through the 100% private (and foreign) owned "Beer Store" monopoly), then it is not voluntary.

There is a reason you can buy Canadian liquor more cheaply in New York state than in Ontario - government monopolistic control and "pricing".

The only truly private sale of alcohol in this province is from a wine shop (restricted by law to selling ONLY wine it produces) or brewery shop (at the brewery itself).  Government Crown corporations and government-protected foreign owned beer monopolies are not free, and so generate taxes.

You admit that in your first post, but you use different words:  "Profits would need be replaced by new taxes."  So LCBO "profits" = "taxes".  A rose by any other name is just as oppressive.

Our liquor laws date from 1927, a result of the end of prohibition.  Those draconian laws were meant to ensure state control over citizens' consumption of the demon liquor.  It is now 2013, and we have liquor laws from when Al Capone was running Canadian whisky across the border.

The Tories can't win the next election fast enough.

Last edited by Stratfordian (2013-04-11 16:23:06)

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#7 2013-04-11 17:16:09

Blueline
Member
Registered: 2008-06-25
Posts: 191

Re: LCBO Strike

Stratfordian...the question remains. If you open the market do you want to pay more taxes to make up the loss or reduce services.

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#8 2013-04-11 19:21:54

Steel
Member
Registered: 2008-02-16
Posts: 2521

Re: LCBO Strike

Blueline wrote:

Stratfordian...the question remains. If you open the market do you want to pay more taxes to make up the loss or reduce services.

There is no loss....everything the LCBO reports as profit is a TAX....

In every instance where booze distribution has been privatized the resulting income (taxes) to the government grew....Alberta being the example I am familiar with.

The LCBO is NOT a business....its a government agency...to collect taxes

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#9 2013-04-11 19:24:50

Steel
Member
Registered: 2008-02-16
Posts: 2521

Re: LCBO Strike

Privatization will create more choice....and probably more Ontario wines on the shelves...and hence more investment in the ontario winery business....more revenue to the Government and LESS COST to us.

Why?....because we will no longer have to pay the bloated overhead of the LCBO and the $50,000/year union cash register jockies

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